USA Election 2016

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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Lamby »

i don't really mean to come across like i'm targeting you specifically if it seems like it, my debate tone is probably a little more caustic then necessary so don't take what i say personally, outside our disagreements on the subject i'm sure you have your reasons for your opinions like i have mine, and it's not as if the race is over like you said.

like i said, i support sanders, and if she said those alleged things today you can bet i'd call her out on it, but if i end up with the two then i guess i feel safer with the person who is inconsistent but with less vitriol and more sustainable policies with the more believable philosophy changes. it's not ideal and if i am left with that choice i'll just hope congressional elections pick up that slack
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

Don't worry about it, you weren't using words to say I was any of that.

Also, if anyone's interested. I want you to look at this video and seperate fact from fiction, if you truly hate Trump, learn the truth and pride yourselves in challenging a politician on such a thing. While I won't name who, I believe some people here might have been fed lies. It's only right to know the difference, especially since those turn into harder points to challenge people on at a level they can't disagree with.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Nano »

Yo if anyone is interested in getting the facts in around 1/3rd the time: John Oliver more or less destroys Trump's image of success with video evidence.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by wic. »

"Communism is socialism" is my favorite meme. Especially because anyone, despite whether or not they agree with either policy, who has taken a basic high school level government class should know that they're not.
Goat wrote:You have the following

Emails
Benghazi
Travelgate
Whitewater
Cattlegate
Filegate
Chinagate
Pardongate
Solictation of Funds recieved by Peter F. Paul
IRS Abuse against Republicans and other enemies
The Death of Vince Foster where Clinton Staffers removed evidence before police arrived
Clinton and friends deleting Email related information

Personally, I can't imagine why people would vote for her just to avoid having Trump in office. His tax plan and healthcare plan is great! Especially for people suffering from the monopolies on drugs.
Emails - she's shared all of her nonpersonal emails at this point
Benghazi - i ain't gonna touch that, i just don't care about it, and honestly its up for the committee to decide
"""Travelgate""" - not indicted
Whitewater - Man this is such ancient history and was settled so long ago, she was never charged with anything
"""Cattlegate""" - Dude that's even more ancient, nothing ever happened, there wasn't even an investigation
"""Filegate""" - Exonerated
"""Chinagate""" - I'm not too sure where she was involved with this, to my knowledge she wasn't at all.
"""Pardongate""" - Not at all related to her whatsoever, who her husband decided to pardon was his choice. He pardoned less people than Reagan did, tho.
Paul v. Clinton - Went to court dude, it was thrown out. Paul even appealed it and it was thrown out Again.
IRS abuse - I'm not too sure about this one (I don't doubt it though), but if it did happen it would have been under Bill's administration, not hers. It's worth noting that it's pretty common practice though.
Vince Fosters - This theory is largely purposed by conspiracy theorists and I can't really remotely find valid sources for it other than some author self advertising a book about the suicide. However, there were multiple investigations by Congress that dispelled the conspiracy theories and upheld it was a suicide. She isn't going to be barred from a presidency over conspiracy theories.
Deleted Emails - Doesn't matter, they were found.

I really dislike Clinton, but yeah, none of that stuff is gonna prevent her from a presidency and none of it will get her in jail, most of the stuff you listed are Huge Reaches that she had not been involved with/not indicted/or exonerated. Benghazi won't either. She might lose an election because of it, but she wouldn't be ineligible for presidency. I think the committee will find her not responsible. Especially after multiple, I think 2, GOP congressmen said that it was set up to go after Clinton.

I support Senator Sanders, and the Michigan primary is on the 8th and plan on voting for him. A lot of people fail to realize that one man, even the president, cannot change our economic system from capitalism to socialism, and that ignorance is why a lot of people are afraid of the "big bad jewish commie". He wants to introduce more socialist policies, yeah, but we already have socialist policies, most of the developed world does as well.

But Sanders won't win, unless he takes it court. With the way the DNC is set up, it's a rigged race because of the superdelegates. I don't know if he'd do that, but he might. Superdelegates, delegates who are selected by the DNC and free to support any candidate, really overthrow the will of the people in these kinds of situations. What makes it frustrating is that even the GOP doesn't use superdelegates.

As for a Trump presidency, I worry about it a lot. Much more than a Rubio/Cruz presidency. Regardless of what I think of his politics (Despite the fact I am very well informed on his stances, I do not agree with him), the man has no tact and wants a job that requires tact. He would be smart to surround himself with very, very experience politicians, both for his cabinet and his running mate. I don't trust a hypothetical president Trump to not mouth off to other heads of state and piss someone off.
Goat wrote:
He is Drumpf
Drumpf was an angelicized name his grandfather took to avoid anti-german sentiments during world war one.

Edit: I want to say more but it's too early to call it. I'll definitely say more in the coming months should the situation change.
Yeah, except he was a bit of a dick (and as we now know, a hypocrite) to Jon Stewart for changing his surname from Leibowitz to Stewart, done to prevent antisemitism in his industry.
Goat wrote:Also, if anyone's interested. I want you to look at this video and seperate fact from fiction, if you truly hate Trump, learn the truth and pride yourselves in challenging a politician on such a thing. While I won't name who, I believe some people here might have been fed lies. It's only right to know the difference, especially since those turn into harder points to challenge people on at a level they can't disagree with.
As for this, thanks for the link, I guess, but I'm not gonna watch it. I try to not let people with YouTube channels feed me my opinions like that. It's incredibly easy to just find facts, it's not hard at all, which is why I'm always skeptical of videos like this. Let me have one man with a camera present me the "facts" and decide what is fact and fiction for me? Nah son, that's so incredibly lazy, it's so uninformed. It's so typical of the average voter nowadays. I'm more than capable of doing my own research based on numerous sources, my own observations, and even Trump's own website to come to the conclusion that Trump is not the candidate I want to support.

Also it's 2long.

Come November it's most likely going to be Clinton v Trump. It's not ideal on either side, I view it as a a lesser of two evils situation. I will most likely Begrudgingly vote for Clinton. I'm more than well aware of a lot of the ways Hillary has flipflopped, and I'm more than well aware of a lot of the ****** things she's said in her past. I'd rather have person with experience who flip flops all the time than have someone as caustic and tactless as Trump. (Who also flip flops all the time)

At this point I'm just hoping I can vote in my college's district and not take an hour drive to just a vote.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Jeffery Mewtamer »

Based on what Fox Boy posted, it sounds like Trump is one step away from wanting to re-instate Feudalism or at least granting the modern aristocracy old world titles of false nobility and say screw you to everyone else. Certainly doesn't turn my mental image of Trump as a less charismatic Adolf Hitler whose scapegoating muslims and mexicans instead of Jews and gypsies into something more agreeable.

As for the list of charges Goat levels at Clinton, to be quite blunt, it reads like a list of verbal diarrhea from the mouths of the worst kind of armchair activist and doesn't mention any actual charges I can evaluate as to whether I think they justify imprisonment. If you're going to accuse someone, it's a good idea to mention actual charges rather than just listing a bunch of cryptic names given to assorted events and assume your readers have any idea what you're talking about. The only -gate I know anything about is Watergate, and my knowledge of that is limited to it involving the Watergate Hotel, tapes presumably containing incriminating contents, and it leading to Nixon's resignation. The only other -gate I've even heard of is gamergate, and while I know nothing about it, I've gotten the impression that my sanity is better off not knowing.

Now, if the suggested sentence was "barred from holding public office", you'd have a much easier time convincing me.

As for communism and capitalism, I'd sum it up as follows:
Capitalism is making economic decisions according to one's self-interest.
Communism is making economic decisions according to the community's common interest.
The two do not form a dichotomy, they form a dynamic.
In a truly free society, every individual is free to choose, on a case-by-case basis, whether to act capitalistically or communistically.
Like with most dynamics, neither extreme is wholly good.

At this point, I'm kind of hoping Trump and Clinton get the major party candidacies, one of the minor parties picks Sanders and we have a true 3-way race for once ending in an upset victory for a minor party. Then again, I'd like to see any outcome that says US voters are finally waking up to the fact that both ruling parties have been doing an awful job on average for most of living memory.

Also, if you don't mind me asking, what is your disability, Goat? I myself am mostly blind due to detached retinas(right during infancy, left in my mid 20s) and while I forget the name of Batty's condition, I know it leads to progressive deterioration of most, if not all, muscle groups.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

As for the list of charges Goat levels at Clinton, to be quite blunt, it reads like a list of verbal diarrhea from the mouths of the worst kind of armchair activist and doesn't mention any actual charges I can evaluate as to whether I think they justify imprisonment.
Don't throw stones in glass houses Jeff, I'd also rather avoid disclosing my disability out of personal reasons as well.

Given that it seems even Republicans are trying to side with Hilary if they can't stump Trump, the USA kinda deserves electing a tyrant over a career criminal. Personally I doubt he's as tyrannical as people make him, politics and media can make anyone look bad. Ultimately however, I accept a reality where Trump loses and we simply get more or less the same up's and downs under anyone else. Better to accept that now than fill myself with too much excitement over his presidency
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Nano »

Dude talked about his penis during a presidential election.

Not only does he have an inferiority complex, but he's being totally immature and doesn't seem to realize that nobody cares about that. His penis size isn't gonna help the country. I never watched it in context, but even if someone else made a comment about it to him, he's still x10 more immature for not just saying "yeah that's immature, anyhow let's get back to real politics."

Trump can't talk real politics though. His website has been the most constant thing about him during his presidency. Otherwise, he's been flip flopping all over the place.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

He only talked about it because Rubio said he has a small penis at his own rally.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by wic. »

Jeffery Mewtamer wrote:At this point, I'm kind of hoping Trump and Clinton get the major party candidacies, one of the minor parties picks Sanders and we have a true 3-way race for once ending in an upset victory for a minor party. Then again, I'd like to see any outcome that says US voters are finally waking up to the fact that both ruling parties have been doing an awful job on average for most of living memory.
I don't think Sanders would do that, he would rather have Clinton get into the White House than splinter the party have give Trump and easier time getting in.
Goat wrote:
As for the list of charges Goat levels at Clinton, to be quite blunt, it reads like a list of verbal diarrhea from the mouths of the worst kind of armchair activist and doesn't mention any actual charges I can evaluate as to whether I think they justify imprisonment.
Don't throw stones in glass houses Jeff, I'd also rather avoid disclosing my disability out of personal reasons as well.
I don't know, I'd much rather have Jeff's verbosity than someone who thinks that adding -gate to everything is actually a good idea. It's a pointless and stupid trend, it's nondescript, and honestly it downplays the real scandal of Watergate.
Goat wrote:He only talked about it because Rubio said he has a small penis at his own rally.
Rubio making fun of his penis size at a rally = pathetic

Trump bringing up and defending his penis size at a Republican debate and on national television = somehow even more pathetic
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

It was not my choice to add gate to them, that was simply the popular naming of each one that I brought here. I do not believe it downplays Watergate, that is your opinion.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Jeffery Mewtamer »

I don't know, calling the Bill Clinton Pardon Controversy Pardongate without any explanation and expecting people to have any idea what you're talking about doesn't seem like a very effective means of communicating your thoughts, much less persuading people to your stance. Do it a dozen times over, and it feels like your trying to discredit someone without even trying to construct a proper argument.

And from what I read of the Wikipedia page on the Bill Clinton Pardon Controversy, I'm inclined to agree with most of the pardons Bill handed out and have to ask how what Bill did in office affects Hilary's fitness to hold office.

As for candidates talking about their genitals, while I agree it isn't exactly a mature thing to do, it's hardly relevant to whether or not they'd make a good leader. One of the most iconic images of Albert Einstein has him sticking out his tongue at the viewer, something most would consider quite immature but it doesn't diminish the fact he was one of the greatest Minds of the Twentieth Century.

I'm not convinced any of the major party candidates are fit to lead, but I think the candidates themselves do enough mud-slinging without us joining in.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

I'll be entirely honest, I wasn't trying to do much just yet. He's not the candidate yet, and the republican party still needs to be demolished before I can put an effort.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Nano »

I dunno Jeff, I don't think many good leaders talk about how massive their junk is on tv.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Dr. Roivas »

I mean like

You could argue LBJ but I don't know enough about him to say whether or not he was a good leader

But that dude loved to talk about his junk

although he wasn't a petty child about his dingdong, so
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by CFood »

Goat wrote:Don't worry about it, you weren't using words to say I was any of that.

Also, if anyone's interested. I want you to look at this video and seperate fact from fiction, if you truly hate Trump, learn the truth and pride yourselves in challenging a politician on such a thing. While I won't name who, I believe some people here might have been fed lies. It's only right to know the difference, especially since those turn into harder points to challenge people on at a level they can't disagree with.
I loved that. I just watched it and I already knew this stuff prior, but I'm glad someone is actually just stating facts and not decontextualizing everything he says. I watched his announcement speech. When he said "When Mexico sends its people, they're not sending the best. They're sending people that have lots of problems and they're bringing those problems. They're bringing drugs, they're bringing crime. They're rapists and some, I assume, are good people, but I speak to border guards and they're telling us what we're getting." I knew right then Trump was gonna be the middle of a ****storm. And every time I tried to converse with a liberal to bring them the facts, they dismiss it and some even start calling me a racist, which is simply ridiculous.

I play devil's advocate on both sides all the time. Because like most people I would assume, I don't line up perfectly with either side. I debate against what I prefer a lot, just to strengthen their argument and my own, people bring points to my knowledge that I did not know of or even consider before. This is one of the few places I feel like everyone is actually respectable in discussion, and I'm learning points of views that aren't boldfaced with my point of view is trash and I should feel bad. So shoutout to you guys.

I do agree with Trump in that there is a problem with illegal immigrants, and there for certain are criminals among them besides being illegal immigrants. Do I agree that we need to build a wall? Not really. What I do think is that it should be easier to legally immigrate into America. I do question why he said "they're sending" as if it's actually the Mexico government that sends them or something instead of them just personally deciding to come to America.

General rant about voters
Spoiler:
It's kinda sad that voters now like me at 20 are in the internet memeing era. This whole election has devolved into memes and jokes. The only things most people know are what NowThis and Buzzfeed say about Trump and Hillary, and Marco making fun of Trump.

Topic? More chao?
Bernie: Yeah, I would personally love more Chao, somethingthatsoundsgenerallypopularandinformed
Hillary: Oh yeah, I love to chao down on food!

How many people actually know their political opinions? It doesn't seem like very many do, but, that's just from what I see. And I don't exactly feel confident if our future is gonna be determined by who can make the best memes. I mean, people will do what they want, but I'll be sitting here questioning the intelligence and awareness of my own generation.

Then there's so many Bernie supporters that don't know a single thing about Trump besides the NT and BF reportings. And then there's the Bernie haters that don't even give his ideology a chance or though and assume he's incapable of basic economic math (because they're experts I guess).

Heck there's also many Bernie supporters and many Trump supporters that don't even know what Bernie and Trump believe in. There's even video proof for Trump, excuse the SoFlo channel
Yeah, I see you Batty, I'm not that educated, lmao. I know the basic concepts of Communism and Socialism, and they're basically the same to me. Like I said up a bit, I learn new information whenever I partake in a discussion or just go look up information, I definitely don't even know what all the candidates think. (I also hate that word educated, Tumblr somehow made it feel elitist and that you can't have an opinion or partake in discussions if you aren't, and it's a personal belief/opinion of mine that you can't be 100% knowledgeable and informed on anything, so that mentality just bugs me)
Look at dem ocarinas tho:
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

What I find ironically hilarious is the amount of democrats who actually agreed to Trumps immigration plan on muslims when his name wasn't attached to it.

Godwin's law aside, I hate how elitist of a term "educated" has turned into as well. You have history texts online, you have websites that run the facts, you have access to a lot of information but you can never seem to debate a socialist or a communist on equal terms to them because you are seen as "uneducated" for not falling into the trap of college like they probably have.

The longer this goes on, the more MGS2's prediction on the future becomes true.

Debating with liberals is really damn hard no matter what you are. A shocking amount of racism can be easily exposed but they will never admit to it given that they control the narrative on racism. Argue on the platform of despite being a hispanic and you support Trump, you are seen as an uncle tom. Your opinion is suddenly shut down and they have nothing more of substance or effort to say to you. They will demean you and see you as a puppet for their opposition, their condescending attitudes toward you is there, and given the existence and reality of programs such as affirmative action, the condescending attitudes are always there. But why stop there, why not go further and have them see what they can attack you on. Cisgender, heterosexuality, being a male, such things they see as points they can grab you on and never let go of. The only solution, is to never apologize for being who you are, people are varied, people are flawed, whipping yourself over your mistakes just to run around and act like you're the moral guardian does nothing to convince anyone and is only ever used as a platform for those who can exploit it, Shaun King, Al Sharpton, the list can go on.

It isn't fair to release a diss on just liberals, let's attack the "right". American Conservatives are a little easier to tackle when it comes to certain points in my books, but given just how much liberal media has ingrained in so many people, even me growing up, that they are the "bad guys" each and every time leaves me disillusioned with media in general as a reliable source. Now, plenty of those conservatives oppose Trump and are putting in a lot of effort to stop him. Time will tell if they can put a stop to him, you can't expect liberals to help their longtime enemy, so chances aren't looking so well for conservatives. Given my time looking into Trump and the rest of the establishment, the conservatives are still stuck in the god damn new millennium of politics if they still think Russia should be our enemy rather than our rival, or even our friend. It's as simple as them not being able to represent what the right wing of america actually wants, and the right wing refusing to follow suit. That's why you have two anti-establishment republicans on the way to take the white house, Cruz having more ties than I'd like to outside influences and Rubio being the republican poster child, we'll be stuck in another 16 years of "CONSERVATIVES ARE EVIL, LIBERALS ARE ANGELS" rinse and repeat, and stay more or less floating in mediocrity under him or Hilary.

Sanders however will burn in hell like the socialist he is, but that's just the anti-communist in me talking.

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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by CFood »

It's funny that I give liberals a terrible time so much, but my general mindset is right in that belief set, lmao

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This was back in July 2015.

If anyone's interested http://www.politicalcompass.org/
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by wic. »

Sanders however will burn in hell like the socialist he is, but that's just the anti-communist in me talking.
And just like that, in one fell swoop, any points you brought up about liberals just bashing on conservatives you may have had are nullified and you expose yourself as a hypocrite.

The fact that anyone would condemn a man to Hell based on the fact they don't agree with his economic policy is honestly a joke and really pathetic.

You're literally no better than the people you're talking about when you do stuff like that, bro.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

He's an idiot who'll support socialism and has had multiple communist sympathies in the past despite the awful and true nature of communism against the world.

Not again, not in Poland, not in Russia, not in Peru, and not here. The grass might look greener, and if it's that green then you can move to it instead and leave the rest of us here trying to fix our garden.
You're literally no better than the people you're talking about when you do stuff like that, bro.
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If Trump wins, he might ruin the USA and you and everyone else gets to be proven right
If Bernie wins and he makes us better than we are now then we're all happy. I don't believe he will, I'll hate him through and through, but I'll have to accept he was a good thing won't I?
Ideally I think Trump is the right option right now, since my favorite is already out of the race. However until he gets through a few more caucuses I refuse to stick my neck out for him over an internet debate that has no possible benefits for anyone.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Lamby »

new world older 23 (in a month) year old elitist liberal commie tumblrina queen socialist idiot bound for hell coming through. usually i try to be a good girl but in all that there's just a lot i couldn't take seriously
CFood wrote:(I also hate that word educated, Tumblr somehow made it feel elitist and that you can't have an opinion or partake in discussions if you aren't, and it's a personal belief/opinion of mine that you can't be 100% knowledgeable and informed on anything, so that mentality just bugs me)
are you actually telling me a misinformed opinion should have the same intrinsic value as one that is an educated opinion

that is utterly ridiculous. socialism and communism have objective differences and to say otherwise is purely willful ignorance. also when you're talking about an influx of immigrants, reduce a significant number of those millions to things that justify beliefs held by actual racists, it doesn't matter what trump actually meant, because only offering a "some are great" is disingenuous and a total statistics distortion that ignores the humanitarian crisis and that actual people and children are already struggling here and it's astounding you are surprised that it could come across as racist. republicans might have different ideas on how to tackle the issue (listen to republicans 20 years ago talk about it, you'd think they were the liberals hurting your pride on tumblr) but somehow they've never had a kkk grand wizard try to endorse them. if you don't think there is a correlation with trump's sophism and drawing out the most bigoted support there is, i don't know what to tell you. liberals aren't the only people outraged by his behavior.
Goat wrote:What I find ironically hilarious is the amount of democrats who actually agreed to Trumps immigration plan on muslims when his name wasn't attached to it.
then they're as bigoted as he is, are you surprised islamophobia reaches across isles?
"uneducated" for not falling into the trap of college like they probably have.
please tell me people have not deluded themselves into believing this anti-intellectual inferiority complex, i mean i can't see another reason
The longer this goes on, the more MGS2's prediction on the future becomes true.
remember when video games start bleeding into reality ask someone for support. i'm sorry, i've seen this before and it is one of the most paranoid analogies i've ever seen
Sanders however will burn in hell like the socialist he is, but that's just the anti-communist in me talking.
it's okay we're getting more public support than ever before and it's a train that you'll have to hop on whether you like it or not in a couple decades, because eventually people with views like yours will be outdated. HAMMER AND SICKLE HAMMER AND SICKLE 1984 LA-LE-LI-LU-LO
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Memes Welcomed)

Post by Goat »

new world older 23 (in a month) year old elitist liberal commie tumblrina queen socialist idiot bound for hell coming through. usually i try to be a good girl but in all that there's just a lot i couldn't take seriously
seeeeee, seeee, they wont even try to hide it anymore
are you actually telling me a misinformed opinion should have the same intrinsic value as one that is an educated opinion
No one likes being called an idiot or being told their opinion is misinformed, you approach the talk in a way to get them to realize their faults. Otherwise their ass will harden and much like a teenager who rebels against a parent, they will only be emboldened by the opposition to their opinion.
that is utterly ridiculous. socialism and communism have objective differences and to say otherwise is purely willful ignorance.
Socialism is meant to lead the capitalist nation into a communist one, next.
also when you're talking about an influx of immigrants, reduce a significant number of those millions to things that justify beliefs held by actual racists, it doesn't matter what trump actually meant, because only offering a "some are great" is disingenuous and a total statistics distortion that ignores the humanitarian crisis and that actual people and children are already struggling here and it's astounding you are surprised that it could come across as racist.
Do you lock your front door at night?

Some are great, some are running from the crisis, some caused that crisis and enter here to create more of it. Now we have a border patrol, but it has weakened and recently been told to step down as well.
but somehow they've never had a kkk grand wizard try to endorse them.
Nation of Islam likes him too.
liberals aren't the only people outraged by his behavior.
Liberals will only stay with them against him as long as it's convenient. Next week they'll be right back at Red VS Blue
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Cruz Control Edition)

Post by Jeffery Mewtamer »

Since someone linked the political compass, I took the test again:
Economic Left/Right: -6.38
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.33

Pretty sure that makes me more of a Left Libertarian than any previous testing, and last I checked, the entirety of mainstream US politics was entirely within the Right Authoritarian quadrant, though I can't read their charts on the Major party candidates of the current election.

I also find it funny that Goat says socialists are going to hell considering that some of Jesus's teachings included rejection of ideas that are part of modern capitalist philosophy and promoting ideas compatible with socialist/communist ideals. Not to mention that greed, considered a virtue among hard-line capitalists is one of the seven deadly sins. If Heaven and Hell exist, and Jesus's teachings are in-line with the standards the cosmic judge uses to decide who goes to heaven and who goes to hell, I'd think socialism would be a weight on the heaven side of the scales. Granted, most dictators would probably end up in hell regardless of economic leanings, what with Pride and Wrath being common sins among dictators and Pride's standing as chief among the seven.

Religious musings aside, I honestly have no idea what conservative and liberal mean in the context of US politics, and I have a feeling if you asked a dozen self-proclaimed liberals what liberal means, you'd get 13 different answers, and if you asked a dozen self-proclaimed conservatives what conservative means, you'd again get 13 answers. As a result, I tend to tune out parts of any post that talks about liberal and conservative as if they actually mean anything.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Cruz Control Edition)

Post by Lamby »

No one likes being called an idiot or being told their opinion is misinformed, you approach the talk in a way to get them to realize their faults
if their fault is that they're misinformed, a rational human being with mature social skills would take that as "maybe i should do more research" or "better support myself with actual academic data" instead of the irrational alternative you describe. i have no sympathy for someone being contrary or resistant.
Goat wrote:Socialism is meant to lead the capitalist nation into a communist one, next.
i have already explained the difference between socialism as communism sees it and socialism as an independent philosophy

like i said, at this point it's willful ignorance to ignore that because it doesn't fit your narrative, but you've admitted as much so i'll leave it alone
Goat wrote:Do you lock your front door at night?
for privacy and wild deviant romance, not because i'm afraid of the immigrant boogeyman
Goat wrote:Nation of Islam likes him too.
the washington post:

"Louis Farrakhan, leader of the Nation of Islam, praised Republican presidential front-runner Donald Trump on Saturday for, as Farrakhan put it, not accepting money from the Jewish community — comments delivered just a day before Trump appeared on CNN and failed to condemn white supremacist David Duke, who voiced support for Trump's campaign.

'Not that I'm for Mr. Trump, but I like what I'm looking at,' Farrakhan said in Chicago on Saturday, according to Nation of Islam video of his speech first highlighted by the Anti-Defamation League. Farrakhan appeared to suggest that he enjoyed the chaos Trump brought to the fight for the Republican presidential nomination.

Farrakhan's comments came during a ceremony for Saviour's Day, an annual celebration of the birth of the man the Nation of Islam considers the "Messiah of the Christians." The group — disavowed by mainstream Islam -- believes that the white race was created 6,000 years ago by a black scientist named Yakub."

so what's your point? that the bigotry and religious and social delusions of people trump inspires has diversity, which makes him even more dangerous? if anything that just bolsters my argument.
Goat wrote:Liberals will only stay with them against him as long as it's convenient. Next week they'll be right back at Red VS Blue
i don't even understand what that means. please don't assume other people understand your preconceptions. i'm against anyone who indirectly panders to the lowest kinds of attitudes in america, has a terrible economic plan, has a questionable lgtb (something obviously critical for me) track record, who's healthcare plan actually thinks HSAs, repealing the AFCA, and economic voodoo is better than universal healthcare that he once even briefly supported. and it's no passing fad. and if there are people that fickle, i'm sorry

but being that we fundamentally disagree on politics, i guess i'll just leave it at that because we could probably keep going back and forth forever on those fundamentals and i'll accept that and won't try to keep prodding because at this point i'm becoming arbitrary and making stupid jokes and admittedly being catty

___

anyway i'll do that compass again (will edit in momentarily):

Image

for jeffrey:

Economic Left/Right: -8.63
Social Libertarian/Authoritarian: -7.28

is anyone surprised

edit2: okay cruz control, i like that, that's clever
Last edited by Lamby on Sun Mar 06, 2016 2:01 am, edited 3 times in total.
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Cruz Control Edition)

Post by Nano »

I've yet to grasp the idea of how Trump having one or two good policies (that plenty of other candidates have) somehow equates to him being a decent politician and a likely choice for president.

He's gone on record to say multiple racist and bigoted things on nearly any interview he goes on, makes a complete fool of himself in front of supporters like that one time where he basically admitted he has no idea who supports him or what his campaign is even about. I've thrown MULTIPLE accounts of his blatant racism and his general being an awful human being into this topic and somehow, in some twisted and messed up way, there are still some of you who truly think of him as a possible president. There are little to no words to describe the disappointment it makes me feel as an American knowing that people will elect a complete moron into office because "oh he had like, one good idea i guess".

Again, he was endorsed by the KKK for a reason, not just random love. Do not sit back in your chair and look at only his economic policies, because those policies don't matter nearly as much as what his social policies will do to people. An economy can recover on its own, albeit a bit slower.

Triert I see your Bernie is a socialist and therefore evil, but that's completely ridiculous. America itself has a few socialist policies that are working out fine, Denmark does, other countries in general will always have socialist policies, especially ones that promote freedom. You're simply scared. You're scared that it might be a possibility.

I can guarantee you, with our system of government right now, we would not turn into the Soviet Union Mk. II. That's impossible, congress would NEVER allow such a thing to happen. You're purposefully using his socialism as a shield so that you won't be attacked, much like how many Trump supporters use his (awful) economic and border plans as a way to twist his image into anything other than a lying manipulative racist who relies on the anger of Germans Americans to fling himself into office.

Bernie knows he can't make America socialist, that's not his goal. His goal, believe it or not, is to help Americans. Not some Americans, like the whites and some of the good Mexicans, all of them. Hiding behind his socialist title without even mentioning his policies at all just further confirms you have no idea what you're talking about when it comes to socialism, let alone him as a person.

Speaking of ignorance, if you're admitting to being ignorant about politics, do not talk about politics. Do not talk about things you know nothing about unless you're willing to learn about them in greater detail from people who actually do research into it.

I despise Hillary, Ted Cruz, and Trump because all of them are awful people who don't care about Americans nearly as much as personal gain. These are the types of people who will make bad presidents and we'll go through another 8 years of "ohhhh if only we hadn't voted THEM into office sob sob cry cry"
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Re: USA Election 2016 (Cruz Control Edition)

Post by Goat »

Praise FDR all you like but he threw the japanese, german, and italians into camps. At least Trump wants to keep people out instead of in. Now this isn't saying he wasn't the person that got us through the war, but if people are going to lecture me on why Trump is Toupee Hitler then I'll be the one to remind people that he's a little bit nicer in what he plans to do to foreigners.

Both programs later expanded upon under the man who drafted us into Vietnam, and expanded again under Nixon. Did I mention Trump doesn't plan on touching any of them?
Speaking of ignorance, if you're admitting to being ignorant about politics, do not talk about politics. Do not talk about things you know nothing about unless you're willing to learn about them in greater detail from people who actually do research into it.
communism sees itself as an end to capitalism where socialism is defined as a necessary transition stage between the two stages.
- Bat
Socialism is meant to lead the capitalist nation into a communist one, next.
- Goat

I understand my ideological opponent very well, is it time to give the debate on socialism and communism it's own topic?
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